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So I've upgraded from my 2.5i to a 3.0si

2003 - 2009, roadster, coupe, facelift
Mangozac
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So I've upgraded from my 2.5i to a 3.0si

Post by Mangozac » Mon Aug 31, 2015 5:59 am

Hi all, it's been a while since I've posted, mainly because (A) I wasn't doing any more updates to my Zed and (B) she was still giving me fault-free driving. I still love owning a Z4 but if I'm honest I was starting to find my lowly 2003 2.5i a bit boring. Although the M54 is a fantastic engine, I was sick of its relative lack of torque. Maldives blue looks beautiful in certain lighting conditions, but I was starting to feel like a change.

For quite a while I have been keeping an eye on Z4M Roadster prices here in Oz (with a standing alert on carsales.com.au any time one gets listed) and that search occasionally picks up facelift 3.0 models. It seems that 3.0si models are quite rare and when one popped up near me a few weeks back I saved it. The owner was in a rush to sell and over a couple of weeks dropped the price a couple of times, to a point where it really had my intention, so I went and had a look.

So it's a 2006 silver grey 3.0si with 100,000 kms on the clock. It's got every single option bar satnav and M sport seats. What was particularly interesting was that the owner had had a quad exhaust conversion done (and done very well, I might add). I checked it out and put a deposit down immediately, pending a mechanical inspection. The N52 was very tappy on startup (the car only gets driven on weekends and I was the first to inspect it), but I knew that was a normal sound and couldn't find any other issues.

So a week later I found myself in the possession of two Z4s:
Image

The new Zed definitely provides the visual upgrade I was after. The additional power and torque aren't too bad, either 8)
While the owner had been fairly fussy in keeping the car clean, it was very superficial and any areas that couldn't be seen were absolutely filthy. Under and behind the seats was so disgusting that I ended up pulling out both seats so that I could vacuum and shampoo the carpets. It all came up like new, though!

I've been driving both Zeds since I bought the new one (only a one car garage so the blue one is always outside now). In doing so I've noticed a couple of things about they way the new car drives:

1. The quad exhaust conversion looks great, but sounds terrible. He had the stock muffler replaced with some unimpressive aftermarket thing. It's all exciting when you drive the odd car with a loud exhaust, but living with it sucks. It drones terribly under 2.5k RPM. Sure, I want to hear it scream at 4000+ RPM, but below 3000 I don't want to hear a thing. I expect that's possible; I'm just going to have to find a decent exhaust shop who knows how to tune things.

2. The steering on the new car is far stiffer. It has the M-sport wheel but that won't make a difference. It wouldn't have anything to the M-sport suspension that the car has? I don't think it's a fault with the electric steering, since it's not that hard to turn. I don't like it though so I'd like to work out why it's so much different.

3. Talking suspension, I always knew that the Z4 had firm suspension, but the M-sport suspension seems even harder!

4. The clutch is quite tight. On my 2.5i the clutch is absolutely perfect: not too heavy, not too light. But driving the new car immediately after there is a massive difference and it doesn't feel anywhere near as nice. Would this have any relation to the 6-speed box on the 3L? I have read that old hydraulic fluid can cause a stiffer clutch and since there's no record of a brake fluid change for quite a few years I figure it would be worth my while doing a flush very soon.


Interestingly, with regular driving the N52 hasn't rattled again ever since my first test drive, so I'm happy with that!

Sorry about the long post. By the way, if there's any Aussie readers here who might be interested I will be putting the blue Zed up for sale very soon ;)
Has anybody got any feedback on my comments above?
Current: 06 E85 M Silbergrau
Previous: E85 3.0si Silbergrau, 03 E85 2.5i Maldives Blue.
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Re: So I've upgraded from my 2.5i to a 3.0si

Post by Stark » Mon Aug 31, 2015 8:01 am

Good write up mate and looking forward to any updates on your new car.

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Re: So I've upgraded from my 2.5i to a 3.0si

Post by Toe-side » Mon Aug 31, 2015 9:28 am

Loving the plate. Nice update
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Re: So I've upgraded from my 2.5i to a 3.0si

Post by phil.a » Mon Aug 31, 2015 9:57 am

it sounds like except for the upgrades you still prefer you 2.5

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Re: So I've upgraded from my 2.5i to a 3.0si

Post by Marlon » Mon Aug 31, 2015 10:36 am

Interesting to read your comparison between the two cars
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Re: So I've upgraded from my 2.5i to a 3.0si

Post by jamesbond » Mon Aug 31, 2015 11:23 am

still think the pre facelift has the better rear ... and the m54 3.0i is a great engine
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Re: So I've upgraded from my 2.5i to a 3.0si

Post by WJB » Mon Aug 31, 2015 12:06 pm

Nice pair of cars I assume the blue 2.5 will be going now it's being left outside!

Ignoring the colour, spec, condition etc, is the extra money to change from 2.5 to 3.0 worth it in your opinion? Do you prefer the engine and 6sp box of the 3.0?
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Like I told my last wife, I says, "Honey, I never drive faster than I can see. Besides that, it's all in the reflexes."

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Re: So I've upgraded from my 2.5i to a 3.0si

Post by Mangozac » Mon Aug 31, 2015 11:22 pm

Thanks for the comments!
Toe-side wrote:Loving the plate. Nice update
Yeah, the plate of itself is worth a bit of money, so it was a good score!
jamesbond wrote:still think the pre facelift has the better rear ... and the m54 3.0i is a great engine
I used to think that about the prefacelift rear, but in person the facelift rear looks so much more modern and I prefer it now. The M54B30 is a great engine, but the N52B30 isn't exactly a step backwards either ;)
phil.a wrote:it sounds like except for the upgrades you still prefer you 2.5
WJB wrote:Ignoring the colour, spec, condition etc, is the extra money to change from 2.5 to 3.0 worth it in your opinion? Do you prefer the engine and 6sp box of the 3.0?
I'll admit that I do have a bit of dumb sentimentality towards the 2.5, being my first Zed and all. I was thinking about it while driving this morning and I'm almost certain that my problem is solely with the exhaust on the new car - it's seeming more and more obnoxious. The 6 speed box is cool and I do love having the extra power available when I want to take off.

Edit due to misinterpretation: The 3.0 is definitely an improvement over the 2.5, so if looking for your first Zed I would definitely recommend going for the 3.0. I wouldn't recommend upgrading from owning a 2.5 to 3.0 for the engine alone, but in this case it's a newer car, updated styling and better equipment too. The 2.5 does drive beautifully and has ample power 90% of the time.

The new car is also a lot tighter. The doors have improved insulation so they close with a solid thud rather than the horrible, tinny sound on pre-facelift doors.

I'll certainly keep you all posted with progress on the exhaust system. I'm away on vacation next week so I'll have to wait until I get back to start looking at it :/
Last edited by Mangozac on Tue Sep 01, 2015 12:09 am, edited 1 time in total.
Current: 06 E85 M Silbergrau
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Re: So I've upgraded from my 2.5i to a 3.0si

Post by WJB » Mon Aug 31, 2015 11:43 pm

Mangozac wrote:I would say no, it's not worth the extra money to upgrade. The 2.5 drives beautifully and has ample power 90% of the time. But that's just me - I'm sure others would feel differently.
Thanks for your opinion, food for thought :)
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Like I told my last wife, I says, "Honey, I never drive faster than I can see. Besides that, it's all in the reflexes."

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Re: So I've upgraded from my 2.5i to a 3.0si

Post by Mangozac » Tue Sep 01, 2015 12:05 am

WJB wrote:
Mangozac wrote:I would say no, it's not worth the extra money to upgrade. The 2.5 drives beautifully and has ample power 90% of the time. But that's just me - I'm sure others would feel differently.
Thanks for your opinion, food for thought :)
I just noticed though that you don't have a Zed yet, so my interpretation of what you were asking was off. I'll update my previous post to correct.

If looking for your first Zed I would definitely recommend going for a 3.0L. For the same age there's negligible difference in price between a 2.5 and 3.0. I wouldn't have done it just for the engine upgrade alone, but considering it's a newer car with better equipment I felt it worthwhile.
Also, here in Australia you have to pay a duty of 3.5% every time you buy a car (even a used car), so upgrading like I did gets expensive. It sucks seeing how freely people are able to swap cars overseas - here it would send you broke in government fees :x
Current: 06 E85 M Silbergrau
Previous: E85 3.0si Silbergrau, 03 E85 2.5i Maldives Blue.
Mods: Gaptech OTH+R, Dension Gateway 300 with USB, CDV-, clear side indicators, euro tails, stubby, MFSW retrofit, OEM Bluetooth/VR

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Re: So I've upgraded from my 2.5i to a 3.0si

Post by enzed4 » Tue Sep 01, 2015 3:25 am

Time to switch any goodies from the old to the new (clear brakelight, gaptech, etc?).
Did your 2.5 have the 'sport' button? Just wondering if that would have made a difference. It works great on my 2.5Si, but that has 218HP over the 2.5i's 192HP to start with, so I'm in no rush to upgrade. Besides which, the cost of fuel here makes the 2.5Si a more bearable than anything bigger (not that anyone should ever buy one of these cars to be sensible...)
Congrats on the new to you 3.0Si - it looks great.
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Re: So I've upgraded from my 2.5i to a 3.0si

Post by WJB » Tue Sep 01, 2015 6:30 am

Mangozac wrote: I just noticed though that you don't have a Zed yet, so my interpretation of what you were asking was off. I'll update my previous post to correct.

If looking for your first Zed I would definitely recommend going for a 3.0L. For the same age there's negligible difference in price between a 2.5 and 3.0. I wouldn't have done it just for the engine upgrade alone, but considering it's a newer car with better equipment I felt it worthwhile.
Yeah you're right, I'm just struggling to find the correct engine/condition/colour/interior combo! And was thinking shall I widen my choice by looking at 2.5's. Think I'll persevere with my search for the 3.0 as I'm in no rush. Cheers.
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Like I told my last wife, I says, "Honey, I never drive faster than I can see. Besides that, it's all in the reflexes."

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Re: So I've upgraded from my 2.5i to a 3.0si

Post by Mangozac » Tue Sep 01, 2015 11:50 am

enzed4 wrote:Time to switch any goodies from the old to the new (clear brakelight, gaptech, etc?).
Did your 2.5 have the 'sport' button? Just wondering if that would have made a difference. It works great on my 2.5Si, but that has 218HP over the 2.5i's 192HP to start with, so I'm in no rush to upgrade. Besides which, the cost of fuel here makes the 2.5Si a more bearable than anything bigger (not that anyone should ever buy one of these cars to be sensible...)
Congrats on the new to you 3.0Si - it looks great.
Yep, have already been swapping some bits - the Dension media player was first. Not sure if I'll do the Gaptech, as I don't want to have to screw around restoring the wiring. Plus I've recoded the new car using NCSExpert so I can open and close from the remote anyway. I'll be swapping over the bluetooth ULFs, as the one in the new car is only a 9th Generation, whereas the one I bought when I retrofitted the old car is a 13th gen. The 9th gen doesn't work properly with my phone (works fine on the girlfriend's iphone though).

Funny you mention the clear brake light: the seller included one with the new car. He had bought it but never got around to fitting (go figure!). The thing is, I'm not sure I want to swap it over. I feel that on the Silbergrau colour the red centre brake light actually looks good and matches nicely with the tail lights. We'll see how we get on!

Let's not talk about the increased fuel costs. The new car does use noticeably more fuel. Although, depending on the type of driving one does, the difference in fuel usage between 2.5i and 3.0i models is potentially quite small due to the 6 speed gearbox on the 3.0. Going from a 2.5i to 3.0si is a big jump though and I guess if running costs are a big concern it would be wiser to stick with the smaller engine.
WJB wrote:Yeah you're right, I'm just struggling to find the correct engine/condition/colour/interior combo! And was thinking shall I widen my choice by looking at 2.5's. Think I'll persevere with my search for the 3.0 as I'm in no rush. Cheers.
Just be patient. You're lucky that there are way more Z4s available in the UK compared to here in Oz - and let's not talk about the fact that they're half the price they are here!
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Previous: E85 3.0si Silbergrau, 03 E85 2.5i Maldives Blue.
Mods: Gaptech OTH+R, Dension Gateway 300 with USB, CDV-, clear side indicators, euro tails, stubby, MFSW retrofit, OEM Bluetooth/VR

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Re: So I've upgraded from my 2.5i to a 3.0si

Post by mj2k » Tue Sep 01, 2015 12:10 pm

My wife has a 2.5si and when I compared it to both my old 3.0si and my current M, her clutch is a lot lighter & frankly feels a lot better.

Think it must just be one of the differences with the cars to be fair, I just accepted it rather than do any research but interested if you do discover anything.
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Re: So I've upgraded from my 2.5i to a 3.0si

Post by Mangozac » Tue Sep 01, 2015 11:06 pm

mj2k wrote:My wife has a 2.5si and when I compared it to both my old 3.0si and my current M, her clutch is a lot lighter & frankly feels a lot better.

Think it must just be one of the differences with the cars to be fair, I just accepted it rather than do any research but interested if you do discover anything.
OK that's very interesting! It's not that the clutch in the 3.0si is unbearably heavy, it's just a really noticeable difference when you get out of one and into the other. I just wanted to make sure it was normal.

Do you have any comment regarding the steering on the 3.0si vs the 2.5i? I was shuffling the cars around last night and was actually surprised how much lighter the steering is on the 2.5i. Looking at the parts breakdowns on RealOEM, the steering rack and column are both identical. I should query the steering control module and see what differences in software there are...

I also forgot to answer this earlier:
enzed4 wrote:Did your 2.5 have the 'sport' button? Just wondering if that would have made a difference.
Yep, I believe all Z4s sold in Australia came with the Sport button. My understanding is that when the sport button is on the steering will be a little heavier (tighter), but I've only used it once or twice on the new car, so all of my comments are with regards to it being off.
Current: 06 E85 M Silbergrau
Previous: E85 3.0si Silbergrau, 03 E85 2.5i Maldives Blue.
Mods: Gaptech OTH+R, Dension Gateway 300 with USB, CDV-, clear side indicators, euro tails, stubby, MFSW retrofit, OEM Bluetooth/VR

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