About to Buy a Z4 - Clutch Question

[propaintballa]

So then, a quick update and an explanation as to why I have put off posting an intro thread. Would be great to have some input on the following!

So I've driven the car about 450 miles now, got a good feel of it and have started to notice quite a few problems with the vehicle. The first was the N/S xenon headlight not doing the levelling sweep when turning the lights on, guessing this is likely the motor in the lamp as the O/S works fine?

Next, was having issues with the alarm going off randomly/not setting properly. I narrowed this issues down to the bonnet switch, have since unplugged it for now with no more issues.

Next up is the pretty wayward handling. Flat roads it's alright, tramlines a bit but nothing you wouldn't expect. However, undulating road at moderate speed, it feels like the car is trying to throw me in every direction apart from straight! I sometimes get a knock/rattle noise coming off the drive over a bit of a bump so have put this down to some form of bush. On a similar note is the vibration under braking, probably not helped by potentially bad bushes, maybe warped discs but I did not notice this during the test drive.

By far the most worrying though is the characteristics of the gearbox. Now, I've driven a couple of Z4s before, both the smaller engined, 2.5si model, but guessing the same 6spd GB? They always seems pretty tough to use in the lower gears, but this one seems to be taking the cake. It's pretty hard to get into 1st, but the worst is into 2nd, no matter what I try, it will grind. I've tried low revs, high revs, holding the revs to match when changing, double clutching, you name it, the damn thing is never smooth. I have also experienced 3rd pretty much flying out of position when I go to change into 4th. Does anyone know what this is likely to be, as I am super reluctant to drive the car as a result.

Luckily, the car has a warranty from the dealer (not main dealer), so it's going back next week. I've searched for all of the above issues with so many different diagnoses, does anyone have experiences of them they might be able to add? So frustrating as it has ruined that lovely honeymoon period!

My 3.0 n52 engined e89 started to do the same-jumping out of 3rd with grinding sounds closely followed a week later by 2nd doing the same.
I was told the syncros had gone & I handed the car back to the dealer
Rob

Christ, not what I wanted to hear! Did they not want to sort it out then?

[Smartbear]

After a few phone calls back & forth I was informed bmw would not sell spare parts for the box, only a complete replacement at nearly 4K (plus fitting)
Dealer then resorted to a gearbox guy he knew who reckoned he could get the bits (god knows where from as bmw weren't selling them)
I'd lost faith at this stage & asked for a refund, the car had been mine for 4 weeks.
Ps, almost forgot-the dealer asked me for half the cost of the repair as well...
I'm glad I returned it now, very stressful at the time though!
Rob

[propaintballa]

After a few phone calls back & forth I was informed bmw would not sell spare parts for the box, only a complete replacement at nearly 4K (plus fitting)
Dealer then resorted to a gearbox guy he knew who reckoned he could get the bits (god knows where from as bmw weren't selling them)
I'd lost faith at this stage & asked for a refund, the car had been mine for 4 weeks.
Ps, almost forgot-the dealer asked me for half the cost of the repair as well...
I'm glad I returned it now, very stressful at the time though!
Rob

Good lord. I am super paranoid about gearbox problems, as I had one fail on my Fiesta ST at 60k miles. Was about £2000 to replace that one! I am calling the dealer on Monday, at which point I'll tell him more about the gearbox problem and I guess, see what he says. It will be a shame to give the car back, but at the same time, he surely will not be able to sell it on without rectifying the current issues :/

[Mike6]

Are you honestly saying you walked away from a car where you were worried about potential clutch and steering issues and then went and brought a car where there are gear change problems. I may have missed something in this thread but surely you took the car out for a test drive before parting with cash. If gear change problems were evident why on earth buy the thing. Z4s are hardly rare animals and there is always a perfect example around the corner.

[propaintballa]

Are you honestly saying you walked away from a car where you were worried about potential clutch and steering issues and then went and brought a car where there are gear change problems. I may have missed something in this thread but surely you took the car out for a test drive before parting with cash. If gear change problems were evident why on earth buy the thing. Z4s are hardly rare animals and there is always a perfect example around the corner.

Clearly the issues were not that evident during the test drive! They're not rare, but it's also very hard to find a good one it seems. If they won't warranty repair it, they can have it back, no biggie

[Smartbear]

Are you honestly saying you walked away from a car where you were worried about potential clutch and steering issues and then went and brought a car where there are gear change problems. I may have missed something in this thread but surely you took the car out for a test drive before parting with cash. If gear change problems were evident why on earth buy the thing. Z4s are hardly rare animals and there is always a perfect example around the corner.

Clearly the issues were not that evident during the test drive! They're not rare, but it's also very hard to find a good one it seems. If they won't warranty repair it, they can have it back, no biggie

My e89 was fine on the test drive & the first 3 weeks, it went downhill all of a sudden.
Rob

[propaintballa]

Are you honestly saying you walked away from a car where you were worried about potential clutch and steering issues and then went and brought a car where there are gear change problems. I may have missed something in this thread but surely you took the car out for a test drive before parting with cash. If gear change problems were evident why on earth buy the thing. Z4s are hardly rare animals and there is always a perfect example around the corner.

Clearly the issues were not that evident during the test drive! They're not rare, but it's also very hard to find a good one it seems. If they won't warranty repair it, they can have it back, no biggie

My e89 was fine on the test drive & the first 3 weeks, it went downhill all of a sudden.
Rob

Seems to be exactly what I am experiencing

As I'm so paranoid about gearboxes, I definitely would have noticed the current symptoms during the test, had they been present. I guess I'll have to wait to see what he says, the guy deals in exotic cars usually, so he can't be a stranger to large warranty bills!

[chaweiner]

I am at 112k on the original clutch. I bought it at 50,200 exact miles. I drove it two weeks and removed the delay valve in the clutch line as it causes all sorts of ill shifting in low gears and low Rpm's. I'm planning on taking it on trips again, so i will be putting a new clutch kit in it next month.i run redline d4 atf in the 6 speed and redline in the diff.

I have also replaced a lot of the suspension last week. Note I am a car tech by trade so I saved quite a bit in labor.
Power flex Rear trailing arm bushings
Bilstein oem shocks and struts
Sumitomo all season tires (45k warranty and they're sticky)
Power flex control arm bushings
Meyle control arms
Meyle sway bar end links
Radiator and thermostat housing

Also a new driver side mirror and windshield trim
And a new CCV.

[LewisB]

Clearly the issues were not that evident during the test drive! They're not rare, but it's also very hard to find a good one it seems. If they won't warranty repair it, they can have it back, no biggie

My e89 was fine on the test drive & the first 3 weeks, it went downhill all of a sudden.
Rob

Seems to be exactly what I am experiencing

As I'm so paranoid about gearboxes, I definitely would have noticed the current symptoms during the test, had they been present. I guess I'll have to wait to see what he says, the guy deals in exotic cars usually, so he can't be a stranger to large warranty bills!

Any update from the dealer OP?

[propaintballa]

I am at 112k on the original clutch. I bought it at 50,200 exact miles. I drove it two weeks and removed the delay valve in the clutch line as it causes all sorts of ill shifting in low gears and low Rpm's. I'm planning on taking it on trips again, so i will be putting a new clutch kit in it next month.i run redline d4 atf in the 6 speed and redline in the diff.

I have also replaced a lot of the suspension last week. Note I am a car tech by trade so I saved quite a bit in labor.
Power flex Rear trailing arm bushings
Bilstein oem shocks and struts
Sumitomo all season tires (45k warranty and they're sticky)
Power flex control arm bushings
Meyle control arms
Meyle sway bar end links
Radiator and thermostat housing

Also a new driver side mirror and windshield trim
And a new CCV.

Interesting, did you find the GB fluid and CDV made a big difference. This is the problem you see, another one of the Z4s I drove had the CDV mod done, so it was hard to compare, but that did feel much better. The gearbox fluid was one of the things I was investigating, as I don't believe it's done until around the 100k inspection II (could be wrong on this).

My e89 was fine on the test drive & the first 3 weeks, it went downhill all of a sudden.
Rob

Seems to be exactly what I am experiencing

As I'm so paranoid about gearboxes, I definitely would have noticed the current symptoms during the test, had they been present. I guess I'll have to wait to see what he says, the guy deals in exotic cars usually, so he can't be a stranger to large warranty bills!

Any update from the dealer OP?

Yes and no hahaha. Basically to cut a long story short, I wasted loads of time taking it to his garage for them to address none of the issues, they even said they think it needs to go to BMW or at the least a specialist. So spoke to the dealer, expressed my annoyance and insisted I take it to a dealer near my home address. He agreed, though now he seems to think they will be happy to drive it and inspect it free of charge for me to then give the car back to him to take to HIS BMW dealer, which I am also not happy about, nor do I think any garage will do that if they aren't getting the business in the repairs.

It is however, on hold until next week due to other commitments. So I'll have to see what happens, it's getting somewhere though at least. I considered just giving the car back but his behaviour, trying to tell me it passed an MOT with the levelling not working to legitimise it not working made me want to pursue it more. That example amongst the other issues as well, the classic was "It has been sat for a while, it just needs to be driven" really got me!

[Smartbear]

He's stalling, be very careful as after 4 weeks your chances of getting all the money refunded are very much reduced. Take it back to him & tell him to fix or refund.
Rob

[propaintballa]

He's stalling, be very careful as after 4 weeks your chances of getting all the money refunded are very much reduced. Take it back to him & tell him to fix or refund.
Rob

I figure as it has a 3 month warranty that there would be little he could do legitimately to get out of the repairs. I also have emails with him agreeing to my terms (partially, only thing lacking is regarding where it is repaired).

I have had to leave it for this period of time as I'm currently taking my MSc exams so literally could not mess around with the car! He knows all of this by the way, if that makes any difference!

[raymond.harper]

BMW will charge an arm and a leg if the box itself is at fault. Worst case is a recon box but not a £2000 job
http://www.reconditionedgearboxes.com/M ... index.html

[Machine monkey]

I have just changed my clutch. There where no signs of it needing to be done. A single mass and lightweight fly wheel became available on hear so I bright it.

Glad I did as when the box came off my old one was not much longer going to work. It was toast it had done 68k mikes but probably had a hard life. I have done a few track and drift days with it.

[Ducklakeview]

Definitely sounds like the dealer is stalling. Did you pay cash for the vehicle, or is there a finance element? I ask, as if there is finance, they (finance co) are fully responsible for sorting this, as it is THEM that have bought the car from the dealer, and are selling it to you. If there is no finance, did you pay ANY of the cost with a CREDIT card? Again, if so then you can make a "section 75" claim with the credit card co, as they are responsible for the FULL purchase price, regardless of how much was paid on the card.

It sounds like the 2nd gear synchro is failing, you SHOULD be able to change gear without using the clutch if the synchro is fine (need to know what you are doing re throttle etc) but that is the ultimate test for the synchro hubs. My van is now approaching 210,000 miles on it's original clutch, and I can easily change from 1st to 6th and back again once moving, without using the clutch. Must admit I have detected a slight occasional slip in the top 3 gears as of late, no doubt brought about by towing the Z4 250 miles on a trailer last year, but it's not gotten to the point where it's urgent. A job for the warmer weather, as I can "drive around" it, by avoiding 2,500rpm in those gears (max turbo boost/torque)

Mike