What on earth am I thinking about

[Mad Professor]

So my M sailed through its MOT as usual today @ 45k
It's now on SORN until April as my acccess road is too muddy and its too cold to get the roof down
I've had the M now nearly 3 years and its been very reliable unlike most of my previous fun cars
I always wanted an M and its lived up to its reputation in most respects
I bought this one because it had an epic SH and all the relevant bits had been properly sorted
Its fun to drive ,sounds epic , looks great , comfortable ,cheap to insure ,not terrible on mpg [relatively speaking ] , and things don't keep falling off like my old TVRs ,Lotus and Caterhams and the like
SWMBO likes it ,my son likes it ,my father likes -i even like it
So why i am even thinking of switching
Oh and its not like its depreciating either
TBH I cant really think of anything to replace it in terms fo bang for buck
I guess like a happily married man one is allowed to window shop without feeling too guilty eh
Ive just got this feeling that its maybe time for a change
Indeed i'm kind of thinking that a convertable is a daft idea given the ltd opportunities in Scotingland -im not even sure we had a proper summer up here -we certainly havent managed a BBQ for the past 2 years
So if i were to go down the more sensible coupe route instead where would that lead to -i don't think i could find a low miles M coupe as good as this roadster -at least for sensible money
Another XKR perhaps -I cant afford an Evora and i dont fancy a Porsche or Audi...Another TVR -nah i've suffered enough thanks
E89 will depreciate like a stone and its not a modern classic
Here's the thing -how many fun cars out are there in this price bracket with this performance and pedigree ?
So here is my list for a possible replacement :
Circa 16 k
"modern classic"
40-50k miles
Not deisel
Coupe [or roadster ]
Must have road presence ,feel special ,easy on the eye and make a nice noise
Cheap to insure -I pay £126 pa
Reliable and safe and comfortable and heated seats
Preferably manual but auto is a possibility
Fairly quick but not bonkers -TBH i cant really explore the M safely on public roads
Good steering feel and road holding on twisty B roads
No sig depreciation [gosh thats a tough one ] as its a 2nd fun car [that rules out E89]
Colour not really important
mpg not that important as not used that often
Will not induce car envy among ohter road users or when parked in public
Hmm -thats about the lot -not much to ask for eh

[robjones888]

V8 m3

[TMP]

V8 m3

Thats a good shout, the E92 M3 and its wonderful NA V8 CS if you can get it. Cant see these loosing much, if at all.

[Havard]

V8 m3

He used the word reliable. One of my best mates just had a nightmare with his, numerous faults and one that nobody could seem to find the answer to. Maybe he was just unlucky but it certainly changed my mind about having one.

I would go E89 35i manual. You won't lose much on these from here on in I reckon. I would just keep the M though. As a guy who just traded up to a manual 981 Cayman S, I have been lucky that the M didn't sell as I now know which car is the most fun after a month of having both..

There is a sweet spot in ownership and I think the M is probably the closest I have found to perfection if you are looking for fun, running costs, emotion. That noise is just epic.

H.

[buzyg]

S2K.

Fit's the bill. Though not actually my cup of tea.

[MrPT]

The “no car envy” vs “coupe/roadster”, ”modern classsic”, ”road presence” is impossible. Don’t torture yourself.

3L coupe might work. Or save for a Golf R.

[Mad Professor]

Thanks to everyone for the inightful and helpful comments.
I have indeed thought about E89 but i don't see that as being a modern classic -ie its not an M car so prices are just going keep on falling like any other modern performance car -lovely motor nonetheless i admit
E92M3 -ok so its a M car but its more like a daily runner TBH-dont think it will feel special enough to take out for a treat of a drive on a nice summers day -ie just for the sake of driving .
Interested to hear about the Cayman S -although not a big Porsche fan [its the flash image which doesnt fit with my old man persona] as i've heard a lot of scary stories about mega bills -once considered a Boxster S .
What is the issue with the Cayman -and 'im intrigued to know why the M didnt sell as i thought demand was strong
3L E86 coupe isnt really special enough -more of daily IMHO -although i can see it ticks many boxes aside from depreciation [its not an M]
I suppose could always leave the hood up most of the time and pretend I'm in an M coupe -sorted
S2K -driven one of these and very nice -depreciation proof ,bomb proof amazing engine - but its nowhere close to the MR in terms of being an overall experience -and my daily runner is an old CRV
I think this has been catharctic and on reflection I will probably just sit on the M over winter and see what the spring brings in terms of my mood .Each year when i eventually get back into the M it always brings a smile to my face -absence makes the heart grow fonder i guess .

[mmm-five]

Or save for a Golf R.

But expect your insurance to go through the roof if you go for a Golf R

[Mad Professor]

I wouldnt entertain a Golf R unless it was a replacement for my daily
Golf 32 R appeals more though -but not really a mdern classic -too many of them made -ie will continue to fall in price

[MrPT]

Or save for a Golf R.

But expect your insurance to go through the roof if you go for a Golf R

I thought that, but then if it's only £126 at the moment, I'm not sure how high it can go! They are fantastic cars and already a classic, IMHO, in a way that doesn't require low sales volume or the passing of time to realise.

But yeah - sounds like the M is the right one or you already, OP, especially given your amazing car history. I actually preferred having the roadster in Scotland - much more of an experience (if dry) and barely any compromise when wet. Especially if you have a garage or some other means of letting the roof dry out regularly.

[griffnut]

Perhaps you should try a TVR again, maybee one that's been properly sorted/maintained. I have had various TVR's over the past 15 years and never had bits falling off etc.

£16k should get you a nice TVR Chimaera 450, it's got pace and a reasnoble amount of fun plus practicality.

In the past I have also owned a V.Low mileage "M" Roadster, after 4 months due to Trim issues and a lack of smiles per miles I had sold it and boight another TVR Griffith 500. Perhaps I was a succer for punishment!

I don,t think that you would be happy with tin top's, especilally on those rare sunny days.

Whatever you do, a change is as good as a rest.

[mmm-five]

I thought that, but then if it's only £126 at the moment, I'm not sure how high it can go! They are fantastic cars and already a classic, IMHO, in a way that doesn't require low sales volume or the passing of time to realise.

I only say this as a friend swapped his e92 M3 for a Golf R and his insurance went from £450 to £1150.

The reason was due to the risk profile of the Golf over the M3.

Turned out to be true as it was nicked off the drive within 2 weeks.

[Beedub]

keep the MR and make some small changes to it..... what your searching for no longer exists.

EDIT.... it does exist but its about 3-4 times more expensive that your budget.

[tomscott]

Literally nothing worth considering in the price range everything is a downgrade. A 987 boxster S or cayman S I would stay clear of I bought a boxster S earlier in the year had bore scoring and piston slap bill was nearly the price of the car to replace so was taken back to the dealer. It was also no where near as much fun as the Z. I think it was a better car but no where near the grin factor which is definetely where its at for me. You know that the Z is just like COME ON PUSH ME and il put you through a hedge... whereas the Boxster is like you can push me as hard as you want and Il make you feel like a super hero driver, it wears off quickly.

The 35i is a nice car but not as special I would buy one if you were doing a lot of mileage but your not. I would also stick clear of the E92 M3 they sound great but are dull in pretty much every other aspect and there are issues with that engine, find a sorted one... still dull my dad had one for 3 years and quick in a straight line but not much fun otherwise. You just cant chuck them about like the E46 M3 and E85/6.

Ive been in the same boat since selling my Z4M C in 2014. Pretty much coming round to the idea that its the only sensible option going forward.

Unless you have 35K+ to drop. AMV8, 981 S (you can get cheaper but bargain basement spec plus super hard to find) 997 you can buy cheap ones but anyone with any porsche knowledge would know that cheap ones are cheap for a reason also same worries as 987. 997.2 lovely but the price for participation is silly. They are pretty much the only cars on my want list.

The other option ive been playing with which is what ive always wanted is a 996 C4S. Nearly bought one when I bought my Z4M but they were just a touch out of my budget for a good one. Again same issues, they are older, more antiquated, very hard to find in a good spec and well looked after. Thing is at their age the hoses will need doing which are cheap but you have to drop the sub frame which is not cheap, IMS, RMS clutch and flywheel with 50k+ cars. Thats a quick 3-4k before you even get started and would be the same on a 997 as they are 10+ years old now too. Just always loved them and I think (controversially) the rear is the best design on a 911 ever. I also love the way they drive, people drive them and think they are antiquated and dont drive as well but once you get used to it the rest doesnt really compare IMO.

Similar costs for Z4M at the age tho. 10+ YO rubber engine mounts, engine bolts and might as well do the bearings at the same time - 2k for piece of mind vanos rebuild another 1k. So what ever it is, this era of car will need money spent on it at some point.

The Z4Ms although they have gone up in value are still relatively good value compared to anything you look at. Even dog E46 M3s are going for 16k+ redic.

Doesn't really help. I would keep it, finding good Z4Ms are hard too and they wont loose any money. Safer than having money in the bank.

People do talk about relative bang for buck which I completely understand. For me life is too short to keep the same car forever. Its just money isnt it

Although ive just bought a house so its not only money pretty much takes all my available cash atm.

[Mad Professor]

Literally nothing worth considering in the price range everything is a downgrade. A 987 boxster S or cayman S I would stay clear of I bought a boxster S earlier in the year had bore scoring and piston slap bill was nearly the price of the car to replace so was taken back to the dealer. It was also no where near as much fun as the Z. I think it was a better car but no where near the grin factor which is definetely where its at for me. You know that the Z is just like COME ON PUSH ME and il put you through a hedge... whereas the Boxster is like you can push me as hard as you want and Il make you feel like a super hero driver, it wears off quickly.

The 35i is a nice car but not as special I would buy one if you were doing a lot of mileage but your not. I would also stick clear of the E92 M3 they sound great but are dull in pretty much every other aspect and there are issues with that engine, find a sorted one... still dull my dad had one for 3 years and quick in a straight line but not much fun otherwise. You just cant chuck them about like the E46 M3 and E85/6.

Ive been in the same boat since selling my Z4M C in 2014. Pretty much coming round to the idea that its the only sensible option going forward.

Unless you have 35K+ to drop. AMV8, 981 S (you can get cheaper but bargain basement spec plus super hard to find) 997 you can buy cheap ones but anyone with any porsche knowledge would know that cheap ones are cheap for a reason also same worries as 987. 997.2 lovely but the price for participation is silly. They are pretty much the only cars on my want list.

The other option ive been playing with which is what ive always wanted is a 996 C4S. Nearly bought one when I bought my Z4M but they were just a touch out of my budget for a good one. Again same issues, they are older, more antiquated, very hard to find in a good spec and well looked after. Thing is at their age the hoses will need doing which are cheap but you have to drop the sub frame which is not cheap, IMS, RMS clutch and flywheel with 50k+ cars. Thats a quick 3-4k before you even get started and would be the same on a 997 as they are 10+ years old now too. Just always loved them and I think (controversially) the rear is the best design on a 911 ever. I also love the way they drive, people drive them and think they are antiquated and dont drive as well but once you get used to it the rest doesnt really compare IMO.

Similar costs for Z4M at the age tho. 10+ YO rubber engine mounts, engine bolts and might as well do the bearings at the same time - 2k for piece of mind vanos rebuild another 1k. So what ever it is, this era of car will need money spent on it at some point.

The Z4Ms although they have gone up in value are still relatively good value compared to anything you look at. Even dog E46 M3s are going for 16k+ redic.

Doesn't really help. I would keep it, finding good Z4Ms are hard too and they wont loose any money. Safer than having money in the bank.

People do talk about relative bang for buck which I completely understand. For me life is too short to keep the same car forever. Its just money isnt it

Although ive just bought a house so its not only money pretty much takes all my available cash atm.

Yep I think that has convinced me that moving on from the MR is pure folly and likely to end in tears
Mine had a lot of money spent on it getting it all sorted -which is why I bought it -prev owner was a BMW master mechanic and basically did whatever was needed -all carefully documented in a neat folder
While my heart would love another TVR -it would have to a precat big valve Griff -and then youre talking >20k for a half decent example
Dont think my head would allow me to go down that road again as im hopeless with spanners