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Another Castle Combe trackday vid, tyre comparison

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TomK
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Another Castle Combe trackday vid, tyre comparison

Post by TomK » Wed Nov 08, 2017 7:43 pm

As some may know I go to combe pretty regularly as it's the closest place for me to get my track fix :evil: As such it gives me a chance often to test out any mods, chassis changes, tyres to really see how they affect the drive of the car and also the time that might (or might not) be gained.
This video was a day a couple of months ago now, I'd been fiddling around with the geo earlier in the summer and managed to make the car quite considerably worse. Retracing the steps meant that I settled on a setup I felt pretty happy with. I'd been running NS2R nankangs for track work for a while and for the money had felt they were pretty ok, but this summer I found a good deal on some AD08R yokohamas. I put them on before going to Goodwood in August, the car felt great but I had no reference point it being my fist time round. At Combe a few weeks later I immediately dropped a second from my times with the NS2Rs and have on my most recent visit just got into the 1:16s (1:16.9!). Bearing in mind it's quite a power circuit and an M4 has been clocked there just 1 tenth quicker, it's not bad I think.
The car feels so much better on turn in with the AD08R, it's surprised me the difference just a change in tyre can make to the enjoyment of driving the car, let alone the time difference. They have also been wearing incredibly well vs the NS2R, in short the money saved from buying the cheaper tyre is not worth it in the long run.
http://fastestlaps.com/tracks/castle-combe
Here's the vid, I forgot the type at the end about running out of talent might have been a reason :rofl:
MC[IB], CSL airbox, Schrick 288/280 cams, 4.44FD, UUC SSK, SS race cat back, AP CP9660[F]/5144[R] brakes, Apex ARC-8 with AR-1 or PS5, KW ClubSport 2-way, Turner spherical arms, PMC uniball rtab, VB engine mounts, Rogue pulleys & RSMs, Tillett B6, half cage

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Another Castle Combe trackday vid, tyre comparison

Post by mr wilks » Wed Nov 08, 2017 7:57 pm

Very enjoyable watch :) on the ragged edge at times but impressive , , silly question coming , is the tc off ? If so why ? :?
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Another Castle Combe trackday vid, tyre comparison

Post by TomK » Wed Nov 08, 2017 8:47 pm

Cheers, yes it's a bit ragged in places, I find myself pushing closer and closer to the limits there, perhaps I should spend some more time at a different track for a while :scratchhead:
mr wilks wrote: Wed Nov 08, 2017 7:57 pm is the tc off ?
Yes
mr wilks wrote: Wed Nov 08, 2017 7:57 pm If so why ? :?
A lot more fun in the wet! Much faster in the dry. Won't kill your rear brakes (TC uses the rears extensively when trying to drive like that).
"M-Track" mode is probably worth using on track if you're a bit unsure of things but tbh I've only used it once or twice I think since coding it a couple of years ago.
MC[IB], CSL airbox, Schrick 288/280 cams, 4.44FD, UUC SSK, SS race cat back, AP CP9660[F]/5144[R] brakes, Apex ARC-8 with AR-1 or PS5, KW ClubSport 2-way, Turner spherical arms, PMC uniball rtab, VB engine mounts, Rogue pulleys & RSMs, Tillett B6, half cage

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Another Castle Combe trackday vid, tyre comparison

Post by Beedub » Wed Nov 08, 2017 8:55 pm

great feedback!!!! I've got a set of 888R ready to go on after i finish the NS2R which i can lie have served me so well for 2 sets, I'm looking forward to seeing the difference, i knew the budget slick would have it compromises and for the price they have performed so so well for me and I've taken some big competition down at the sprint track scene i love so much, i can only assume from what you've posted this gap will only get bigger when i go premium again.
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Another Castle Combe trackday vid, tyre comparison

Post by Fishy Dave » Wed Nov 08, 2017 8:56 pm

That looks fun Tom 8) I'm sure you're right that the AD08R are faster than the Nankangs, but, it's hard to compare because of the changes made to the car each time. Since setting the shim clearances and the remap 10 months ago you'd mentioned the car felt more powerful, then you've taken out a touch more weight, fiddled with the rear camber and toe, plus I think you've got quicker too. None the less, the stop watch doesn't lie, you're speedy round Combe, not sure I'd be able to keep up now (but I'll have a go)? :driving:
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Another Castle Combe trackday vid, tyre comparison

Post by mr wilks » Wed Nov 08, 2017 8:57 pm

I dunno , i guess its like the kart tracks , i know when ive been on them lap after lap you learn the lines & boundaries & push that little bit harder each circuit as you learn from the last .
Would the lap time not be quicker with tc on though :?
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Another Castle Combe trackday vid, tyre comparison

Post by Fishy Dave » Wed Nov 08, 2017 8:59 pm

Beedub wrote: Wed Nov 08, 2017 8:55 pm I've got a set of 888R ready to go on
Let us know how you get on. Phil and I use the R888R in the PBMW championship on a lighter, less powerful car of course. I've found the R888R to be surprisingly grippy from cold starts, get even better before peaking and starting to slide about a bit by 10 of 15 minutes in. The lap times should certainly fall with them. :)
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Another Castle Combe trackday vid, tyre comparison

Post by Fishy Dave » Wed Nov 08, 2017 9:01 pm

mr wilks wrote: Wed Nov 08, 2017 8:57 pmWould the lap time not be quicker with tc on though
No, it's definitely slower in the dry, it's too intrusive, although it could possibly be faster on a very wet track just for the confidence it gives. I've not compared lap times but from a seat of pants calculation it feels like M Track is quickest in the wet, maybe even in the dry if driving for a quick lap time.
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Another Castle Combe trackday vid, tyre comparison

Post by TomK » Wed Nov 08, 2017 9:02 pm

Fishy Dave wrote: Wed Nov 08, 2017 8:56 pm it's hard to compare because of the changes made to the car each time.
Thing is I did a day at combe just a month or so before with the same engine and chassis changes on the NS2-R so the times I think are comparable. Most importantly though is how much less the car understeered in the slow(er) speed stuff compare to NS2-R. I'm sure that's where all the time was gained and also where the enjoyment increase came from too. The tyre also feels much more compliant on the road than NS2R which is an added benefit.
MC[IB], CSL airbox, Schrick 288/280 cams, 4.44FD, UUC SSK, SS race cat back, AP CP9660[F]/5144[R] brakes, Apex ARC-8 with AR-1 or PS5, KW ClubSport 2-way, Turner spherical arms, PMC uniball rtab, VB engine mounts, Rogue pulleys & RSMs, Tillett B6, half cage

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Another Castle Combe trackday vid, tyre comparison

Post by Fishy Dave » Wed Nov 08, 2017 9:16 pm

TomK wrote: Wed Nov 08, 2017 9:02 pmThing is I did a day at combe just a month or so before
Ah yes, I'd forgotten about that one. I can see the car looked more balanced than I've seen it before, and although you still looked like you were having fun it did appear that your driving was a teensy bit more composed/less lairy? :oops: :D
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Another Castle Combe trackday vid, tyre comparison

Post by TomK » Wed Nov 08, 2017 9:22 pm

Fishy Dave wrote: Wed Nov 08, 2017 9:16 pm did appear that your driving was a teensy bit more composed/less lairy? :oops: :D
You mean faster? :D Hmm, not sure, the tyre felt more predictable so maybe that helps the input...
MC[IB], CSL airbox, Schrick 288/280 cams, 4.44FD, UUC SSK, SS race cat back, AP CP9660[F]/5144[R] brakes, Apex ARC-8 with AR-1 or PS5, KW ClubSport 2-way, Turner spherical arms, PMC uniball rtab, VB engine mounts, Rogue pulleys & RSMs, Tillett B6, half cage

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Another Castle Combe trackday vid, tyre comparison

Post by Fishy Dave » Wed Nov 08, 2017 9:34 pm

Yup, faster :thumbsup:
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Another Castle Combe trackday vid, tyre comparison

Post by bradz » Thu Nov 09, 2017 9:35 pm

Great video!

I'm just trying to figure out what tyres/wheels, Do you think running a 9" up front would be a good idea? When pushing on in the dry I suffer from under steer quite badly.

Tempted to try the Cup 2's...
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Another Castle Combe trackday vid, tyre comparison

Post by TomK » Thu Nov 09, 2017 10:00 pm

Cheers.
I don't know about moving up the front rim size, it's something I've considered (albeit in a square setup). I've increased my tyre size all round relative to stock so a 265 rear and 235 front, but they're still relatively the same as stock.
Assuming your tyres are in good shape and of a decent quality then I'd suggest that the most likely culprit of the understeer lies in the geo setup. When was it last done and what was it set at? The car is very sensitive to adjustments I've found in my limited experience.
I was going to try the Cup2's also, but came across the AD08R at a good price, don't ignore them by any means, great in the dry and wet, wear well.
MC[IB], CSL airbox, Schrick 288/280 cams, 4.44FD, UUC SSK, SS race cat back, AP CP9660[F]/5144[R] brakes, Apex ARC-8 with AR-1 or PS5, KW ClubSport 2-way, Turner spherical arms, PMC uniball rtab, VB engine mounts, Rogue pulleys & RSMs, Tillett B6, half cage

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Another Castle Combe trackday vid, tyre comparison

Post by bradz » Fri Nov 10, 2017 11:15 am

I have a friend with a hunter alignment system,

We have tried various setups, I'm currently running the CSL setup with as much neg camber as the car would allow on stock top mounts - This was with 225's up front and 255's on the rear, and on stock suspension.

I have KW V3's on order & M3 ARB kit so hopefully that will help matters, May need to get some top mounts...
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