Not joined yet? Register for free and enjoy features such as alerts, private messaging and viewing latest posts and topics.

.

"M" Specific discussion
pinkpanther
Newbie
Newbie
Posts: 4
Joined: Sun Jul 26, 2015 2:54 pm

.

Post by pinkpanther » Tue Aug 29, 2017 11:17 pm

.
Last edited by pinkpanther on Wed Nov 29, 2017 9:37 pm, edited 1 time in total.

User avatar
Buckz
Senior Member
Senior Member
Posts: 1112
Joined: Mon Dec 05, 2016 11:00 am
Location: West sussex

Differential Leak - Quoted £4k for new diff!

Post by Buckz » Tue Aug 29, 2017 11:35 pm

Sounds like they're trying to take you for a ride, contact others and see what they say ;) or go after market diff..
Image

User avatar
Newbers
Member
Member
Posts: 569
Joined: Sat Jun 12, 2010 12:10 pm
Location: St Albans (one days march from London)

Differential Leak - Quoted £4k for new diff!

Post by Newbers » Tue Aug 29, 2017 11:52 pm

Opportunity to invest in an LSD.....
Coupe, KW coil overs, PSB limiters, Powerflex ARB bushes, 18" CSL reps, Aero skirts, ZHP leather knob, Whippy and proud. Probably needs a wash :roll:

User avatar
bmwaddict
Senior Member
Senior Member
Posts: 1148
Joined: Mon Mar 07, 2016 8:55 pm
Location: West Herts/East Bucks

Differential Leak - Quoted £4k for new diff!

Post by bmwaddict » Wed Aug 30, 2017 12:07 am

Newbers wrote: Tue Aug 29, 2017 11:52 pm Opportunity to invest in an LSD.....
All M cars come with LSDs as standard.

Pinkpanther give Phil at CPC Performance Engineering a call, really knowlegable and specialize in engine rebuilds and BMW servicing, they did my rod bearing shells, and repaired my sump when it was damaged, and I now use them for all servicing and maintenance. Really good garage with nothing but M cars inside and out, helpful, honest and great service.
Currently zedless :(

'07 Mugello Blue Audi B7 RS4 Saloon with added goodies
'94 Black/Silver/Green Honda CBR400RR
Previous:
'07 Ruby Black Z4MC
'07 Sapphire Black Z4C 3.0si Sport

User avatar
Ducklakeview
Lifer
Lifer
Posts: 6362
Joined: Tue Mar 22, 2016 4:08 pm
Location: Merseyside

Differential Leak - Quoted £4k for new diff!

Post by Ducklakeview » Wed Aug 30, 2017 12:15 am

Shaft seal is about £40. Remanufactured diff is about £1800.

If there is play in the input shaft you should be able to feel it by hand, if not hear it when blipping throttle whilst driving.

I'd take it elsewhere if you aren't mechanically minded.

Worst case scenario, get a quaife atb LSD fitted at Bird's for about £1600 all in, a better diff than the clutch type one fitted from the factory, which at 50k will probably have worn clutch plates anyway.

Mike

User avatar
Buckz
Senior Member
Senior Member
Posts: 1112
Joined: Mon Dec 05, 2016 11:00 am
Location: West sussex

Differential Leak - Quoted £4k for new diff!

Post by Buckz » Wed Aug 30, 2017 12:17 am

Newbers wrote: Tue Aug 29, 2017 11:52 pm Opportunity to invest in an LSD.....
M cars come with lsd standard. An aftermarket one maybe;)
Image

User avatar
GuidoK
Lifer
Lifer
Posts: 3171
Joined: Tue Aug 17, 2010 1:37 am
Location: all over the place

Differential Leak - Quoted £4k for new diff!

Post by GuidoK » Wed Aug 30, 2017 12:21 am

I think you have a good reason to be sceptical.
Without opening up the diff there's not that much to say about the condition, so changing without proper diagnose is tbh not a really professional way to do things.
Do you know what they exactly ment by play? Have you seen it?
Was it axial play? radial play?
How much oil was left in the diff?

The play can be caused by a lot of things, like the flange nut not properly tightened. True that can cause damage to the bearings (those can be changed) or gears, but without opening up the diff thats rather a guessing game. It could be that you only need a new claping bush (thats a £4 part on its own) or that any play has already damaged your pinion/ringgear.


I dont know any UK based bmw diff specialists, but its sure time to get another specialist than the one you have now.
I'm sure there are some UK based companies that specialize in bmw diff refurbishments. Getting the diff there might be a pain because of shipping weight and the possibility that it can leak oil (some parcelservices specifically note that shipping car parts that contain oil is forbidden)
Usually a total refurb costs between 500 and 1k (thats usually cleaning/painting/sandblasting, adjusting/setting tolerances, new seals and (partial?) new bearings). An M diff will be at the higher end of that scale. And if new parts like pinion/crownwheel etc are required that will be more of course.

For these kinds of jobs you musnt go to 'bmw specialists' that do maintenance on cars but to specific driveline/transmission/diff specialists or motorsport oriented shops as fiddeling on a bmw diff is beyond that what is written in the BMW factory workshop manuals (so a 'bmw specialist' or a bmw dealer wouldnt know how to proceed). Its specialized work.

A quaife lsd wont solve this problem as the quaife diff is only the internal diff core. These problems are either related to the bearings/pretention or the crown/pinion.
Z4 3.0i | ESS TS2+ | Quaife ATB LSD | Brembo/BMW performance BBK front/rear | Schrick FI cams | Schmiedmann headers+cats | fully polybushed | Vibra-technics engine mounts | H&R anti rollbars | KW V3 coilovers | Sachs Race Engineering clutch

pinkpanther
Newbie
Newbie
Posts: 4
Joined: Sun Jul 26, 2015 2:54 pm

.

Post by pinkpanther » Wed Aug 30, 2017 1:08 am

.
Last edited by pinkpanther on Wed Nov 29, 2017 9:38 pm, edited 1 time in total.

User avatar
Sae
Senior Member
Senior Member
Posts: 2365
Joined: Wed Jul 08, 2009 7:34 pm

Differential Leak - Quoted £4k for new diff!

Post by Sae » Wed Aug 30, 2017 1:12 am

Hmm, sounds dodgy, get a second opinion if possible. Also, work and parts to replace input shaft seal should be about £300, so sounds like your specialists are on the higher end pricing wise.
Z4MCoupe Sapphire Black

User avatar
GuidoK
Lifer
Lifer
Posts: 3171
Joined: Tue Aug 17, 2010 1:37 am
Location: all over the place

Differential Leak - Quoted £4k for new diff!

Post by GuidoK » Wed Aug 30, 2017 1:17 am

pinkpanther wrote: Wed Aug 30, 2017 1:08 am
They can move the input shaft by hand but i don't know if this is axial or radial play, I will ask tomorrow and see if i can have a look myself.
The input shaft should not be able to move in either axial or radial direction.
However a little bit of rotational play is permitted but thats very little. This is the play between the teeth from the pinion and crowngear and its called backlash. Maximum permitted backlash is I think 0,20 mm for the M diff.
Z4 3.0i | ESS TS2+ | Quaife ATB LSD | Brembo/BMW performance BBK front/rear | Schrick FI cams | Schmiedmann headers+cats | fully polybushed | Vibra-technics engine mounts | H&R anti rollbars | KW V3 coilovers | Sachs Race Engineering clutch

mmm-five
Lifer
Lifer
Posts: 12714
Joined: Sun Nov 30, 2008 1:03 pm
Location: Liverpool
Contact:

Differential Leak - Quoted £4k for new diff!

Post by mmm-five » Wed Aug 30, 2017 8:18 am

I'm on my 2nd diff at 150,000 miles.

1st paid for by BMW as it was under warranty. I hadn't slotted anything amiss, but the dealer called me whilst it was in for an inspection and asked whether I'd be okay with them requesting a warranty repair for the unit...I didn't argue.

2nd was mostly paid for by the insurance company after my pre-Christmas accident in 2015. Seems the lateral impact transferred some damage through the driveshaft and diff...so after a few months back & forth between their engineer and my engineer, it was agreed that I'd pay 1/3 of the cost.

The insurance engineer was adamant that the diffs in similar cars (e.g. M3s) rarely made it past 80k miles, and that was why they were initially refusing to contribute.
Trigger’s Z4MC
Some bits now over 163,000 miles, some less than 1,000 miles.
Individual Ruby Black, Individual extended champagne leather, plus many options

Image

Z4M-2006
Lifer
Lifer
Posts: 7020
Joined: Fri Jun 29, 2012 7:53 am
Location: High Peak,Derbyshire.

Differential Leak - Quoted £4k for new diff!

Post by Z4M-2006 » Wed Aug 30, 2017 9:22 am

I have seen the E46 M3 wear input shaft bearings, the play in the flange can be felt with the prop removed ..
Seal wear is common, but indicated by a small mist around the diff and sometimes on the underpan of the car..

I would suggest a big leak "all of a sudden" could easily be something more ..

That said
£4K is ridiculous on price, you can get a refurb with fitting around £2500.. it's no big deal to fit one ..

Kernow-Z4
Member
Member
Posts: 81
Joined: Sat Sep 10, 2016 10:31 pm

Differential Leak - Quoted £4k for new diff!

Post by Kernow-Z4 » Wed Aug 30, 2017 9:25 am

Leaking Diffs are apparently common on these cars.
The tray does a good job of catching the oil so id imagine if its dripping off the tray then its lost a considerable amount.

I have just had the input and 2 draveshaft seals replaced at my local BMW specilist for £300, so even £500 to replace the seals sounds rather steep...

I can also advise that he E46 M3 diff is different to the Z4M diff, both in part numbers and construction, there are a couple of detailed threads on M3 cutters and American forums showing difference in the outer cooling fins and the internals of the diff. The Z4m diff is far "beefier" than the M3 diff.
2006 Z4 ///M Coupe, Interlagos Blue, Black Leather, Eventuri intake and Stromung Exhaust

User avatar
hopz121
Lifer
Lifer
Posts: 3711
Joined: Sun Jul 03, 2011 4:33 pm
Location: Guildford Surrey

Differential Leak - Quoted £4k for new diff!

Post by hopz121 » Wed Aug 30, 2017 12:38 pm

Who is the specialist OP?
2004 BMW E46 M3 Coupe - Manual - Silver Grey
2017 BMW F31 318d M-Sport - Auto - Glacier Silver
2007 Porsche Cayman 2.7 - Manual - Arctic Silver
2003 Renault Clio 172 Cup - Blue
2003 BMW E85 Z4 3.0i - Gone
2008 BMW E90 330i SE - Gone

User avatar
Yorkie Z
Senior Member
Senior Member
Posts: 2594
Joined: Thu Nov 28, 2013 9:19 pm
Location: Plymouth

Differential Leak - Quoted £4k for new diff!

Post by Yorkie Z » Wed Aug 30, 2017 12:52 pm

£8 for two new shaft seals and a couple hours labour and I bet the problem will be solved. I believe the M diff has more backlash than the rest of the models. Probably a so called specialist being think!!
A Dirty M///

Post Reply