National Service

[TitanTim]

Interesting the Conservatives are looking to bring this back for 18 year olds if they get back in. Either a mandatory 12 month stint in the forces or weekend community service in the Police, Fire, NHS etc.

First thing that springs to mind is how would it be enforced if mandatory, I think things were different in the 50s when it was last in force. I imagine there was more compliance back then. Whilst I'm not tarring all 18 year olds with the same brush as I'm sure many would jump at the chance and opportunity, but I would imagine there would be many who would stick two fingers up and as a vote winner surely its a non winner with younger voters simply going elsewhere than voting for a Party with National Service on the agenda.

Personally some sort of National Service should have been brought back years ago, it might just help educate and broaden horizons for these types of youngsters who are set to be a lost generation with no respect for anything in society.

https://youtu.be/xoGHl6wFG8o?si=-TX3rvh1pRMpYpA4

Tim.

[buzyg]

I would have been a total PITA rebel to any form of national service when I was younger. I wanted and needed to make my own choices to learn and grow. Not be told. As it happens I choose to join the RN, partly to get away from the uni education every one else had me destined for. So I choose to be told what to do, by shouty people with sticks and guns, my choice. As a result I learned the importance of team work and earned as I learned, served and traveled the world. A great result for myself and society. I very much doubt that would have been the case if I was told I was joining. Just my thoughts.

[pvr]

It is a balance whether the young voters (how many vote in the first place) are outbalanced by older voters who think it is a good thing.

The policy itself offering an alternative is a bit odd in weighting. Either a year (365 days) in military or 1 weekend a month for 12 months doing something else. Not quite balanced time wise though.

Facing facts: Russia is a world threat, conscription is happening in Europe so why should the UK not do the same. It will happen some time in the future by requirement anyway as the Russians will continue to invade other countries when they see they can without that much resistance.

Benefits of the military are obvious, respect and order which is hugely lacking at the teenager level. The second part is that you are together with people that you will never normally mix with. You learn about life that way.

[TitanTim]

Yes there does seem an imbalance on the duration between military or community service although I'm sure I read the community part was voluntary which makes it even more unclear, typical

Some other countries such as Sweden, Norway and Denmark already have National Service so don't see why this country shouldn't especially as mentioned with the current climate in Europe although I wonder what resources Russia would have if any in widening any conflict

Will be interesting if it happened what the penalty would be if you refused National Service Unsure how other Countries tackle it.

Tim.

[Pondrew]

Will be interesting if it happened what the penalty would be if you refused National Service

Just saw a 'headline' on my phone regarding this. Apparently none realistically! Great incentive to not do it then.

In the UK in 2024, I just can't see it happening or in any way working. The kids today have been pampered and nannied by the state, then suddenly they want them to go play soldiers?

Then there is the small matter of paying for it. We can't afford a 'real' military so where are the billions coming from to fund this?

[TitanTim]

Will be interesting if it happened what the penalty would be if you refused National Service

Just saw a 'headline' on my phone regarding this. Apparently none realistically! Great incentive to not do it then.

In the UK in 2024, I just can't see it happening or in any way working. The kids today have been pampered and nannied by the state, then suddenly they want them to go play soldiers?

Then there is the small matter of paying for it. We can't afford a 'real' military so where are the billions coming from to fund this?

I reckon some would be willing to participate but I think many wouldn't, I can see a fair bit of disorder coming into play if was mandatory, nice inner city riots for starters. Could you see all the undesirables in society throwing themselves at National Service with a smile. Somehow I don't think so.

I think the expense has already referenced that conscription would still be a cheaper back door way of bolstering the armed forces which has been neglected over the years.

Tim.

[DevonPaul]

It looks like a desperate attempt to woo voters back from reform UK or whatever right wing leanings there are out there.

There's little to separate the 2 main parties these days, except that Labour haven't got the history of recent cockups.

[Vornwend]

Almost certainly the Tories are going to get thumped so this policy has been rolled out in the full knowledge they will never need to enact it. I imagine it won't be popular with the younger demographic (who mostly wouldn't vote for them anyway) but win some back from Reform which is what they are really panicking about now.

The way I see it is the only teenagers who don't mix with other groups enough are those who benefit from private education and attend elite universities. Ultimately these go on to be massively over represented in positions of power (particularly when we get Tory governments).

[pvr]

At least they won’t have the Abbott calculator as they are educated

[Pondrew]

At least they won’t have the Abbott calculator as they are educated

If the primary school my wife works in is typical, they do more 'managing' than educating them these days.

[Ole gits rule]

Yes there does seem an imbalance on the duration between military or community service although I'm sure I read the community part was voluntary which makes it even more unclear, typical

Some other countries such as Sweden, Norway and Denmark already have National Service so don't see why this country shouldn't especially as mentioned with the current climate in Europe although I wonder what resources Russia would have if any in widening any conflict

Will be interesting if it happened what the penalty would be if you refused National Service Unsure how other Countries tackle it.

Tim.

This may assume that the person is working or in college - still not great if you work and then have to give up your weekend, although I also thought the military option was the same a bit like the TAs

[TitanTim]

Yes there does seem an imbalance on the duration between military or community service although I'm sure I read the community part was voluntary which makes it even more unclear, typical

Some other countries such as Sweden, Norway and Denmark already have National Service so don't see why this country shouldn't especially as mentioned with the current climate in Europe although I wonder what resources Russia would have if any in widening any conflict

Will be interesting if it happened what the penalty would be if you refused National Service Unsure how other Countries tackle it.

Tim.

This may assume that the person is working or in college - still not great if you work and then have to give up your weekend, although I also thought the military option was the same a bit like the TAs

Interesting as I would imagine alot of 18 year olds would be at University so how would it interact with studies and that. The weekends would only be the real answer to fitting Military of Public Service in. All the nightclubs would have to encourage pensioners to take up clubbing at a weekend to keep the pubs abd clubs open

Tim.

[Dav the wheel nut]

If national service was introduced there would be a surge in young people claiming they had mental health issues and therefore weren’t eligible

[Ole gits rule]

If national service was introduced there would be a surge in young people claiming they had mental health issues and therefore weren’t eligible

Already started, many bright sparks got in early, some claiming to be cats have a massive head start, if they were claiming to be dogs they could be trained in bomb disposal.

In all honesty its not as per the headline as they are a limited number of placements and its for logistics / cyber security etc.

[Nanu]

I think the military bit is voluntary but the civil would be mandatory. Think it would be only a matter of time before some young oik would have a civil rights lawyer on it claiming it was a breach of some human rights legislation.